Ep 17: When Liars Speak

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Rachel: “Man, his mom must have really done a doozy on him as a child…He lies easier than he breathes.”

Kayla: “Are you talking about the research done by Hays and Carver, “Follow the liar: The effects of adult lies on children’s honesty”?”

Rachel: “Yes I am, That’s the one!!!”

Music Intro
Hey everyone, my name is Kayla
And this is Rachel with Dating Hypothesis, thank you so much for joining us today!

Kids who’ve been tricked by an adult are more likely to peek when told not to, then lie about it afterwards.

What is happening when a liar speaks?

Today’s episode is laid out in the usual three part format. First we will dive into “the liar”, then “the victim”, and we will end on “how this affects relationships”.

In part one, I want to talk about different ways a liar might be created during childhood.

So you mean they start out as the victim?

Yes.

Interesting

Add “Two Beats”
*Begin conversation The liar

Fear: if someone is lying to you…they fear something.

They fear the temper tantrum of a two year old…so they lie to the child.

They fear you will break up with them if they say “I am going to kim’s house for a quicky, I’ll be right back honey”.

They don’t want you to know the truth because they fear what you will do, think, or say.

If we, were all accepted for who we truly are,…we wouldn’t lie.

We would also be the biggest assholes in the universe. Humans in general are pretty selfish and self serving.

So…being forced to behave “socially acceptable” means we have to lie. We are also lazy which makes “white lies” essential. White lies make life easy and more convenient.

Yes, small talk is usually just a bunch of white lies. “How is your day”…”good, it’s good”…meanwhile they just had a blow up fight with their partner.

Or, when my boyfriend asks what I am doing on Friday and I tell him I am finishing a paper that is due on Monday when I am really putting in my time with my two sugar daddies so I can pay rent.

For christ’s sake Rachel…that is NOT a white lie.

For me it is

What the hell is a real blatant lie from you like?

When I tell people I am a Neuroscientist who took a year off to travel Europe for fun.

You did not tell anyone that? You’re a neuroscientist student who got a full ride scholarship to study abroad for a semester.

Yeah! You’re right. It’s inconsequential as well. I guess I only tell little white lies.

Little “white” lies are like, “I don’t have batteries for this toy” or “this store isn’t open right now” or “nope that show isn’t on right now”.

But some parents lie more than that…
Kids should not be taught to lie or keep secrets – “dont tell mommy our little secret”.
Shattering a child’s mind with molestation secrecy and abuse leads to personality disorders because the child literally can’t trust what is up and what is down.
In 2017 Santos gathered data from volunteers showing a greater propensity to lie “if lied to as a child”. They also showed higher levels of psychological damage. They were more likely to suffer from aggressive behavior and antisocial personalities.
Hays and Carver’s experiment in 2014, “Follow the liar: The effects of adult lies on children’s honesty” showed children five years and older were more affected by being lied to. Children younger than five, were less affected. Which makes sense. By the time your kid is five years old you should be talking through scenarios… “you used to white lie about”, …you should be problem solving with them.
For many autistic individuals they struggle to “read the room” they don’t always understand sarcasm, and may not even understand the purpose of a “white lie”. They often think in a factual manner, and may say things considered rude or disrespectful when really it’s their observation or simple opinions. They may mistake sarcasm as truth.

In 2014 Mann et al did a study confirming… “what we all know”… People are more likely to tell lies when they see other people telling lies.

I had a boyfriend admit his dating profile was a pure sham specifically because “everyone else does it”. Which makes sense on one hand…

The hand that loves spiraling down the rabbit hole full of shit…

Yeah, because, if you want someone to find you sexy “then use a current photo”. The only people that will respond to it, will be responding because they find you attractive. Anything shy of that is “hoping your date will be too ashamed or shy to turn tail and run”. Using 20 year old photos to attract a mate is more than delusional…it’s straight up gaslighting, not just catfishing. You are willing to look that person “in the eyes”, defying them to speak up about how you look nothing like your photos. And you are comfortable doing this because “Hey! It’s me in the photo…”. It’s so embarrassing.

The deaf and hard of hearing community find communication frustrating with hearing people. Sign language inflection is based off body language, without proper face or body language they may not realize you’re joking, or if you seem uncomfortable they may assume you’re lying as they cannot hear the vocal tones.

For some they can feel like they are being lied to in conversations where only one person can sign to them, they may feel like information is being omitted due to the interpretation of the signer to them.

I personally have a family member who was born deaf, and at a young age I remember asking another person why they were signing what they were saying when talking to hearing people. She explained to me that is was so the Deaf individual did not feel left out or that maybe we were talking about them. It created trust that they knew what was going on around them.

The worst thing about lying is when you carry the “boy who cried wolf” label around your head. When I catch a boyfriend in a lie, I mentally crash into “the brick wall of doom”. Because I was looking forward to my first healthy relationship and now I know, I’m just in another shit show of a joke”.

So your boyfriend knows you lie to him?

Yeah

And you know he is a chronic liar…?

Yeah

Have you heard of the Prisoner’s Dilemma? It shows how two criminals acting in their own self-interest cannot get both of them set free. So what do we do “if we can’t trust the other guy”? What do we do if we are six years old and we can’t trust a parent because they have repeatedly proven their self interest is more important than the household’s ability to thrive as a whole community? When you choose to parent by lying… Kids have to decide whether or not to trust you. And if you think kids can’t tell, or don’t know, or are too stupid or too young to know when you are lying to them…guess who is the stupid one?
In 2014, Halevy, Shalvi, & Verschuere were interested in the percentages of people who lie. They concluded most lies are told by a small number of people who are frequent liars. If this is true then those few frequent liars are poisoning the general public at large…everytime they lie to someone. Because it spreads like a disease.
It’s a perpetuation, a cycle of abuse. “You don’t trust them “so you lie”, now they don‘t trust anyone else. That’s why it’s best when liars date each other. Keeps you both out of the pool.

And if you grow up in a house with a parent who lies instead of spending time conversing with you, teaching you negotiation skills, you grow up skilled at lying without skills to negotiate. Santos et al decided in 2017 that this puts those kids at risk for developing anti-social behavior. When kids become aware of lies, it affects their behavior — both short-term, and long-term.

Oh shit, read that last sentence again.

When kids become aware of lies, it affects their behavior — both in the short-term, and the long-term.

(sarcasm*) But lies only affect kids’ behavior, right? Like, me or any other adult can handle being lied to all the time without negative effects? Right? Like, I love being lied to. It’s so romantic knowing someone wants to spare my feelings while they swipe right on tinder behind my back.

Kayla, you know it’s okay to lie to someone you love “if it keeps them happy” while getting to do whatever you want.

Lies of omission are still lies but sometimes are ok, such as not telling a child what happened to a pet that passed away or other things that may be too traumatic (though should probably be explained at older ages)

Is it though? When I was a little kid my mom was burdened with five small children and our cat gave birth to a litter. We were so excited. The next morning we all ran downstairs to find the kitten had disappeared. Our mom told us the mother cat must have eaten them. That she must not have known they were babies to take care of. Who the fuck tells a bunch of little children that? And I believed her until I was 40. It would have been so much better for me psychologically if she had just said “there is no way I am having six kittens in this house with five kids too”. We would have been sad, but I wouldn’t have grown up with this twisted story in my head.

How many times do I have to tell you…your childhood was abusive? Most parents don’t say stuff like that to their kids.

A few lies over the years can be forgiven. However, the more you lie…the more your brain is wired to live lying. A person growing up for 18 years in a lie will only feel comfortable in a lie. Because, at that point, it is how your brain is wired.

Are you good at lying? Are you proud of it? Do you think you could cheat a lie detector? It’s a machine. But what about us? We are lie detectors. What happens when we are told “You’re wrong”, when we know we are right? What happens when you know you are being cheated on and you are accused of being crazy?

This portion of the podcast is about the Liar. You are doing something you know you shouldn’t (be it drinking, cheating, spending money). You don’t care. You feel you have the right to do it. You also won’t leave the relationship because your partner is providing you something you want. So you lie. You as a liar…telling someone they are crazy when they know something is off..What does that really make you? You are no longer just a liar. No. You are not just a liar at this point. What are you? When you tell another adult “they are crazy” what are you doing to them? And why are you doing that to them? So you can what? Keep getting it all? And that’s okay? Meanwhile, what is happening to your partner? What is happening to their self esteem, sanity, perception of reality, what are they feeling?

You are no longer just a liar. What are you?

As we learned in previous episodes “the brain will wire up, for, whatever you are choosing to do consistently”.

Your parents wired your brain “around lying” when you were a child.

What does that wiring look like? How much were you told to lie? How often were you told to not lie? What confusing combination of both were you told? Were you told to always be happy which required your entire life to be a lie? Were you told to be a doctor or a lawyer when you really wanted to be an artist? Were you taught to lie in one area of your life, only to get beaten when that spread to other areas of your life… like grades or stealing?

What is happening in your relationships today, when it comes to those lies? Did you choose a partner who, “like your parents”, is “forcing you to lie” about being happy all the time because they won’t acknowledge sad depressed moments?

In 2016, research showed the progress of lying altering people’s brains. When people lied in an MRI, the scientists noticed a burst of activity in their amygdala. The amygdala is a crucial part of the brain that produces fear, anxiety, and other emotional responses–including that sinking, guilty feeling you get when you lie.
The second half of the experiment was playing a game to win money by deceiving a volunteer, they noticed the bright signals from the amygdala began to decrease. Not only that, but when people faced no consequences for dishonesty, their stories got more elaborate.
And it is easy to lie to kids. Even when you know they don’t believe you. We are older, smarter, and the one in power. Too many adults feel justified in lying however they want to their kids.

Another thing my mom did to us five kids was find ways to keep us busy when she was home. She combined her “joy of our gullibility” and her “need for peace” by telling us during the Solstice raw eggs could stand up on end. She had some elaborate story about the gravity and planets lined up pulling on the liquid in the egg so you could balance it on the fat end. So of course we would spend hours getting eggs to stand on end. And “as children are want to do”, we thought we could beat the system and get eggs to stand up any day. So she would “let” us “try” outside of the solstice. I spent my life telling other adults about this awesome phenomenon. I told so many people, and every single one of them looked at me like I was insane. Sure it’s funny for the parent, but the kid spends a lifetime getting strange looks from people. She didn’t just fuck up my childhood. I am literally, still trying to figure out what is true in the world and what was a cutesy little lie she told me.

When we live a lie…how do we see the world? Do you think everyone is happy? Or, do you think everyone is lying while forcing a fake smile?

the more you lie, the easier lying becomes
Lying rewires your brain. We can wire our brain to be super calculators, learn 14 different languages, or… “to get really good at lying”. You can learn to assess people in front of you while you are speaking to them, detect micro expressions and formulate exactly what they want to hear “while you read them” as you speak to them.
I am pretty good at lying. I can be mid-sentence and change what I was going to say based on someone’s facial expression and body language. I can guide the direction of my words based on their reaction second by second. The more a person does this the easier it gets. Like any life focus, if this is your focus, then you will get really good at it.

Science says “the people most skilled at this kind of micro perception” are abuse survivors. Small children who are beaten, molested, or emotionally abused quickly learn to focus on micro expressions in people. It is a survival technique that doesn’t magically disappear when you turn 18 and get into relationships.

I am pretty good at telling when someone is lying. But what about chronic liars or even pathological liars?
What’s the difference?
Chronic liars just lie a lot. Pathological liars can’t help it. Me personally…I think the more a person lies…the less they can help it. I think a chronic liar can turn into a pathological liar just by lying too often…then boom…they find it hard to tell the truth, it’s simply easier to lie. Your mouth just lies even when you didn’t plan on lying. Your brain is literally rewiring with your chosen behaviors. What you focus on is what gets solidified by your neurons forming pathways and then myelinating for speed.
Adrian Raine found pathological liars have structural abnormalities in their white matter that can make it easy for them to tell lies. He says, “They are better wired for the complex computations involved in sophisticated lies.”
But what came first? The chicken or the egg?
He found they have more white matter and less grey matter than people who are not compulsive liars. White matter enables quick, complex thinking. Grey matter doesn’t just control muscles,…it “takes in and links” sensory perceptions to memory, emotions, speech, decision making, and self-control areas of the brain.
So, grey matter places information from the outside world into specific areas of our brain? And white matter helps that information travel all around our brain? The scent of burning wood is processed by grey matter into happy camping areas and danger house burning down areas while white matter allows us to gather that info from around our brain to make complex thoughts and decisions about the scent of burning wood.
Raine thinks extra white matter gives people the links and speed needed to make them good liars. Since these are the first biological differences to be discovered between pathological liars and the general population I am wondering if the white matter grew as the person lied more and more, or if the white matter was there and it made the person lie? Based on what we know about the brain I would speculate the lying made more white matter.
I also believe the small frequent lies would come first slowly building up the white matter.
I have a family member who is truly a chronic liar, to the degree they will lie about unimportant things, for zero purpose. I have known them since they were a child. They did have some childhood trauma, but the abuser was removed from their life at a very young age, yet that little trauma seems to have to caused them to lean towards the almost NEED to lie. Even if it’s a lie they are guaranteed to be caught in. I would love to see their brain scan to determine if it’s filled with extra white matter.
There’s another family member I have nearly cut off, mainly because they can’t seem to keep to the truth, they fabricate expensive lies about medical health issues for attention and sympathy and is always trying to get people to help them financially. I have seen them actually fake medical incidents simply to get attention! They have tricked an Elderly relative into using almost ALL of their life savings to “help” them. It’s sickening. I avoid them at all costs, but will tolerate them at family gatherings. Just the sound of their voice makes me cringe because I know it’s going to be nothing but a lie!
When ordinary people tell lies the prefrontal cortex shows heavy activity because they are doing something unusual. For a pathological liar there is no reason for it to light up bright on a scan. It’s easy for them to lie. Remember, practice makes perfect…even in lying. Are you living with someone “you just realized “told a few lies” you fully believed”? Now think about why they might have tricked you so easily? They must be real good at lying. Why? Maybe they lie way more than you think? A good liar is not someone you want to build a foundation with. And yet, it’s hard to cut someone you care about out of your life. I . Rachel you are dating a chronic liar. Why don’t you dump him?
I love him. I have spent the last four years during a series of break ups guiding him towards letting me in. We are finally in a place where it is almost impossible for him to lie to me because I know all his tricks. And I think after four years he is getting used to me knowing. It is a strange fucked up comfort for both of us.
Multiple studies have looked into narcissism’s relationship with lying.
It turns out the recruited narcissists reported pride in their ability to lie. They believe they are better liars than the average person and they see it as a desirable trait to have. Narcissists like to list their positive traits. Among those traits listed was lying and on the list of useless values was morality, meaning they don’t see any value in being moral. It doesn’t get you anything. It doesn’t get you anywhere. Especially since lying is so beneficial.
We could do a series of studies to see if this is true for all personality disorders. Maybe someday this will be done. In the meantime…Rachel…what do you think?
I would have to hypothesize this is true for all personality disorders. I lie super easy. I don’t see a downside to it. It makes life easier. My favorite is when someone thinks I am lying when I am really telling the truth so I just agree with them and “admit to lying” even though I was actually being truthful. You gotta spice things up sometimes.
We did an episode on personality disorders. Remind me again what causes one?
Severe prolonged abuse. Usually during someone’s childhood. Our coping mechanisms for survival as a child turn us into assholes as adults. Lying is a huge life saver when you are being abused as a child. Own it. Spank it. Change it. You are an adult now. Rewire your brain.

• What is happening “when a liar speaks”? What is happening “when you lie to your partner”? Your kids? What is happening to you when your partner lies to you? When your kids lie to you? What lies did your parents tell you when you were a child?

How did their lies “affect how you lie to your children”? What lies did one parent tell the other that you knew about and they didn’t know you knew?

What lie are you grateful for, that you were told? So many people justify lying, but have you appreciated a lie? Write to us on facebook, twitter, or Instagram.

• Let’s take a quick Commercial break, we will be right back. (wait 3 seconds) And we are back.

Commercial Spot one: (23:05)

Add “Two Beats”
**Resume Conversation The victim

Everyone lies.

Even victims lie.

So, when “is a person considered a victim of lying”? What does it take? What does that look like? Kayla, you are lied to everyday. When does it bother you?

I can’t stand the blatant lies, the ones that make you feel like they think you’re stupid. I work in an impound lot, I see a lot of people who have recently committed Crimes, people who choose to break laws. I have people who will park across the street from my office and walk over, and then tell me, no we got dropped off. Like no, fuck you, don’t lie to my face like that dude. I will not tolerate being lied to over shit I CAN SEE isn’t true! I don’t like being lied to period but that just makes me so fucking mad.

What about you Rach? When does it really bother you?

When I trust them. When I want so desperately to believe in them. When I want to build a foundation with them. When I want to be “in” on all their secrets and know all their “ins and outs”. The moment I catch them in a lie, I know they don’t want me in their inner space.

We all remember being lied to as a child. When we are lied to as an adult we can’t help but think, “What, do you think I am, a child?”

lies are corrosive. It alters our reality, pushing the agenda of the person hiding the truth. Being lied to makes us feel insecure, unimportant – the person lying to us doesn’t even value us enough to tell the truth, to keep us in the loop.

Keep us in the loop? I’ve never thought of lying that way. What do you mean?

When I was married to a chronic cheater we tried redefining our marriage multiple times. At one point, his end of the marriage was open and mine was closed. With the caveat he tell me when he was, so I was in the loop.

I never wanted someone whispering to me that “he was with so and so on such a date and they thought I should know about it”. If anyone ever did take me aside and tell me that, I wanted my original gut reaction to be “yes, sweetie, It’s okay, I know”.

I never ever wanted my face to show confusion, much less surprise.

Well. It was his birthday and like usual I showed up at his office with a cake and balloons. Imagine the embarrassment of his coworkers having to explain to me that he was at home celebrating his birthday with me which was so sweet since I had been coming to his office for years with a cake. They thought he was being so romantic to finally take his birthday off work to spend with me since I clearly cared so much about his birthday. Do you want to know how that mother fucker justified not telling me he was in Portland with a prostitute?

“Well, you said I was free to do what I wanted”.

He still thinks he is right and I was wrong. He still can’t figure out why it was so important for me to know where he was.

Yeah, but how is that lying? It sounds like he just forgot to tell you.

We had never discussed prostitutes. He wasn’t willing to open that can of worms, to have to go through another 20 hour discussion of “am I willing to allow that in our marriage”. He wanted something he knew was a potential problem, so he never brought it up and clumped it with things he knew he could have and do like fuck another girl. Ha ha then did it as a birthday present to himself he was so excited for it he forgot I come to his office every year on his birthday.

Okay, I have read up on personality disorders so I can better understand you, but I gotta say the abuse children go through to result in this must be so devastating.

I’m sorry I don’t know what it’s like to be normal. I was severely abused and neglected as a child.

We did an episode on communication.

Episode two

Communication…Language…Being able to connect with other humans is a gift. Some of us know multiple languages. Some of us are deaf and get left out of a lot of communication. A lie violates the use of language. To purposely distort someone’s world is an assault. It interferes with someone’s ability to make informed decisions concerning their sexual and financial health and desires to live a certain way. You lying to them makes their whole life a lie. It’s not just you living a lie…now they’re living a lie and they never wanted that lie.

Yeah, being lied to just feels ookie. I don’t date nice people. In fact, I am attracted to people just slightly worse than myself, or a lot worse. People who make me look good. That way, I can feel better about myself, I can sit on my moral shelf thinking “at least I’m not as bad as Terry”.

(can you laugh for me here with a “k”)?

I lie, they lie. It’s no big deal. When I lie to a nice person I feel like shit. I weigh it out every time and do my best to get as close to the truth as possible.

Liars like to think lying is telling falsehood. But let’s be real for a moment. Lying is deception, which includes making ambiguous or vague statements, telling half-truths, manipulating information through emphasis, exaggeration, or minimization, and withholding feelings or information that is important to someone who has a right to know.

I am being lied to. What is happening internally?

A victim is confused by the deception, so you are anxious, angry, suspicious,
offended. It’s a subtle hint or jab that you are about to be abandoned which can trigger fearful interrogative clingy behavior.

I’ve been told to my face “I am crazy” even though the signs are all clear, so I begin to doubt myself.

This sounds so unpleasant. I mean, not for the victim…but for the liar. Why would a liar want to live with someone like this? You are purposely creating a nutcase as a partner you have to deal with, live with, or have sex with. How is that a benefit? Is it really worth all that? I mean for god sakes just dump them. Don’t stab them with a red hot poker while telling them they’re crazy.

If you really want to know if someone is lying there are brain scans for $5,000 or $1,000 for volume orders at the University of Pennsylvania through the company “Truthful Brain”. It’s 90% accurate. Three different hardware/software combinations allow researchers to watch a lie as it unfolds within the brain, in real time.
Can you imagine having this machine in your house?
Honey, come here, I have to ask you a question.
“He stares at you, then the machine, and back to you.”
In courts, lawyers and scientists struggle with who should finalize the decision about what is truth and what is a lie.
If you believe your partner is lying to you…set about a difficult task together and ask them a series of questions. Make sure both of you continue the task so their brain cannot lie easily. Lying is complex. It requires cognitive effort.

When a person is engaged in a complex task they tell the truth faster than they can lie. And when instructed to both lie and tell the truth during a complex task, they lied less frequently. Time pressure tasks interfered with lying also, but not with telling the truth.

The good thing about being in a relationship with a liar is you become hyper aware of what lying looks like after that relationship is over. So any relationship henceforth you’ve been prepared to spot it. Which can be exhausting just knowing it is a possibility. So thanks for that, assholes.

When you are done being the victim, (you have investigated enough and gotten your proof)…all of a sudden previously unexplained behavior become less confusing. At the same time, it’s devastating. The trauma shatters your trust and confidence.
Plenty of experiments have been done to show people have an intuitive sense, outside of conscious awareness, that detects when someone is lying. And this begins in childhood. Kids younger than five know when you are lying. They are more likely to brush it off. Kids older than five…they become a victim.
What does that mean?
Well, what did we define a victim as?
A victim is confused by the deception, so they are anxious, angry, suspicious, and offended. It’s a subtle hint or jab that your connection is severed, which can trigger fearful interrogative clingy behavior.

And the most ironic part of all this is children need to learn how to lie. It’s actually important that they tell their first lie on purpose, around four or five years olds. It shows maturity in their cognitive skills. Your job as a parent is to help them master the art of lying. Tell grandma “thank you for the collard greens”. They are so yummy. Tell the stranger “no thank you, you don’t want candy from the white van”. Tell auntie sherry “you love her new blue hair”.
Some fancy words for these skills are Deontic Reasoning and Theory of mind.
Deontic reasoning: the ability to recognize and understand social rules.
And what happens when the rules are broken.
What happens if you confess? Sometimes you get away with it, sometimes you get punished. And, can you learn the difference? What can help affect that difference and help tip the scale? Body language? Facial expressions? Those big baby blue eyes brimming with tears? If you are cocky when you confess, will you get a beating? What affects the outcome?
Learning the difference between a good lie and a bad lie is important.
And finally, most importantly: what will cause more pain? And to whom? The truth or a lie?
Theory of mind is the ability to imagine what another person is thinking.
Children need to understand “they know things” their parents do not, and vice versa—an awareness usually acquired by age three or four.
Austistic children, who find it very difficult to lie, develop white matter at a sixth the rate of ordinary children.
In my house we are Neurodivegent. My oldest son is Autistic and nonverbal. He doesn’t really “get” lying, when you tell him something he just takes it as that, he doesn’t push past or want to know more. My youngest is three and neurotypical. He knows what lying is and has been testing it out himself, and terrible at it. “No mommy I didn’t give my food to the dog!” As I watched him do it. We talk about lies. Don’t lie to mom and dad, tell us the truth. There are known consequences for lying. I will not tolerate it, make a mistake and come clean? Great, we’ll work through it, lie to me and you will not like what I do. That being said I do want them to “Polite Lie”
Okay I will take the bait. What is a polite lie?
Polite lies are things like, “Yes grandma I love the cooked cabbage” even if they don’t. Choosing to say kind things to others even if they don’t completely feel that way in situations where it isn’t hurting someone. Saying you like someone’s art even if you don’t. Things that build others confidence in a way that doesn’t hurt them. Going along with Santa or the Tooth Fairy even when they know the truth and their friends don’t.
What leads up to telling a successful lie? One must suppress anxious or ethical emotions and the automatic impulse to tell the truth. Also we must know the truth; then invent a plausible alternative. We must accurately assess the reaction of the victim as we tell our story in order to adapt the story as we go.
If autistic children find it difficult to lie and they have less white matter, and average people have average white matter, and pathological liars have a noticeable increase of white matter…then pathological liars have too much white matter. Right? I mean, if a pathological liar literally cannot stop himself from lying…then there is such a thing as too much white matter.
What do the brain scans of a pathological liar look like before and after therapy? If their lying decreases significantly after a year…does their white matter also decrease in the same ratio?
If a child is told to NEVER, ever, ever, ever lie. And they grow up never lying…what does that look like? I suspect it is as damaging as other forms of excessive control tactics. I don’t think that helps a child survive in the real world at all.

People with particular injuries in the frontal lobe cannot lie.
Ha ha, no way.
Electrical stimulation of the prefrontal cortex improves lying.
No! Now you’re lying!
I am not. In 1993, a 51-year-old man had “Pinocchio syndrome.” When he tried to lie, he passed out and had convulsions. His condition was a rare form of epilepsy caused by a tumor.
Doctors at the University Hospitals of Strasbourg in France thought the tumor caused the amygdala to trigger seizures when he got anxious while lying. Once the tumor was removed he returned to normal.
Parkinson’s disease and injuries to the frontal lobe stop people’s ability to lie. How do you think they are judged?
Rude, blunt, impolite, curt, heartless?
We tell white lies all the time trying to regulate the intensity in the moment to keep life running smoothly.
If you are a suspect in a crime “being too calm or too upset” will cause extra suspicion. So regulation of facial expression, body language, tone of voice, and intensity of engagement all matter when you are lying.
What about “when the victim is the liar”?
Like me? I date assholes. They all lie to me. I hate it. And for the longest time I was so gullible. I gave every one of them the benefit of doubt in the beginning. The instant I realized these dick faces were just another asshole I unleashed the beast. People with personality disorders: antisocial, borderline, histrionic, and narcissists, lie. We lie. It’s embedded in our disorder. I see it as a, tit-for-tat. You lie, I lie. You cheat, I cheat. But for me, it is something that gets unleashed. In the beginning I just want a healthy functional relationship. So if you’re honest, kind, caring, and loving…then so am I. The instant you treat me less than perfect, heehee yeah…
Let’s say you just found out you were lied to. Does it matter whether it was once, if it is habitual, or if it is a mental disorder? Yes it matters. When do you worry? When is it a problem?
First time
First time?
First time
The first time you become aware…be aware. How easily does lying come to that person? Are there inconsistencies that bother you? Are they willing to have a deep conversation about it or do they blame shift, gaslight, or negate your feelings? Because we all lie. Some more than others.
Science continues to evolve over the years.

Corporations continue to dominate and take over university research funding.

Past research on lying has concluded we have good intuition. We should trust our gut.

Recent research suggests we cannot spot a liar and we should not trust our guts. Why?

Are we getting better research methods? Or is it important to large global corporations and media moguls we be complacent and trusting “when we watch tv and scroll the internet”?

Propaganda is real and it works, or commercials and fake articles wouldn’t exist.

We want to believe what we read and what we are told. We want to trust. Trust is “easier and less stressful” than continually scanning for blatant lies. If science

“the one thing we all trust”

tells us “we can’t trust our intuition”…

we become empty,

readily available for any lie.

-Are you a victim? How long will you continue to be a victim? At what point does “being a victim” become “being an enabler”? You are a victim for a short moment. You don’t get to be a perpetual victim. What are you going to do now? Tell us your stories. We have Tic Tok and Youtube.

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What are you hiding? Take out a notepad and write down everything you are hiding. What are you hiding from your kids? Your parents? Your boss? Your coworkers? Your neighbors? Your partner? And finally, the most difficult…”What are you hiding from yourself”. Make a list. Go through it. What can you fix? How can you be more real? What little steps can you take to be more authentic?

So, How can I change my life to get more of what I want? Or, what can I tell people so I don’t have to hide anymore?

Well, that’s where “what are you hiding from yourself” comes in. If you are an alcoholic, I am not suggesting you set a bottle of whiskey on your desk at work and tell people to fuck off because you prefer being in a stupor.

Steve comes to work and piles up some crack on the corner of his desk so he doesn’t have to go to the bathroom to do it.

Yeah, like doing that in the bathroom after someone just dropped a stinky one is freaking gross. It’s much better to do it at your desk where you can relax and it smells better.

No one bothers switching screens when you interrupt their porn break at work.

Do you mind Jake, I’m trying to bust one out. I’ll put your report on your desk when it’s done…

So if someone is an alcoholic you are suggesting they check into a clinic?

No. I am asking them to take a good long look at their life. Do you have two children around the ages 8 and 12 who are sick of watching you hangover sleep till afternoon only to have you groggley watch tv the rest of the day? Is their childhood being wasted while you drink your life away? If so, get a nanny. Or a girlfriend who cares more about having a family in her life than a decent boyfriend.

Jesus Rachel

I mean, if your drinking bothers you then obviously you can go to a clinic. But too many people want to be an alcoholic. They enjoy the deadening of it. So…Put something in place, that replaces your uselessness. I don’t care if you are an alcoholic. I do care that you also won’t take the steps necessary to provide your loved ones with the care they deserve.

Be more real. Admit you’re an alcoholic. That you neglect your loved ones. Find a human to come into your lives to give them what they need so you can continue to be drunk all the time.

If you are a chronic cheater who only feels validation when stringing along several women, maybe look into ethical cheating, or a poly lifestyle. The other people in the relationship have a right to know if their bodies are at risk for stds.

Growing up Lying was unacceptable, like washing your mouth out with soap kind of things. I got in trouble a few times for lying about playing in the dirt in the yard when I was told not to, one time dad watched me do it, when I came in he asked if I had, and with dirt still under my nails I lied and said no. That was it, a blatant lie, it rarely happened but that one earned me soap in the mouth! It was foolish, and there was no reason to do it really but it is part of growing. I still lie sometimes as an adult, sometimes I say something I wanted was on sale when it wasn’t because I don’t want my husband to think I wasted money, sometimes I lie to my friends and say I have a sick kid to get out of going to events I don’t want to. But then there are negative consequences when you tell the truth too. Parents and partners need to make it comfortable to tell the truth. There shouldn’t be consequences for telling the truth,… instead understand and support them. Help them get what they need while maintaining the structure of life you have built together.

Okay, so Kayla and I both agree that lying is bad.

There should not be negative consequences for telling the truth.

Right. Like my alcoholic scenario. It should be okay to be a bad person doing bad things and ask for help while you continue to be a shithole of a person.

Rachel, alcoholics should check into a facility that can help them and they need a support group as well.

Yeah? And if they are never going to do that? Don’t their kids deserve a good childhood? Right now a father or mother loses custody when they can’t function properly.

Correct. That’s a good thing.

There are so many people in society that are in limbo. If it were more acceptable to tell the truth without destroying their lives…they might ask for help. Instead they resort to lies.

Emotional cheating, financial cheating and other forms of dishonesty come out eventually, in long term relationships.

Intention, vibration, sound, silent lies, half lies, the eyes lie, facial lies, body language lies, trust issues, being made to not trust your own gut, tricking you into thinking you are crazy, making you think you see and view the world wrong, If you can’t trust your gut…what can you trust? What else are you getting wrong if you think they are lying, but you are really processing the information received from your surroundings incorrectly?

David Ropeik said it best when he wrote: “Being lied to hits us in a deep, dark, ancient, and very important place. It prompts powerful emotions because it’s tied to our instinct for survival.”

*And yet, telling the truth can be equally as destructive to a person.

I would like to introduce next week’s episode. Episode 18: Replace His Brain.
Brains are being grown in lab. Genetic modification is happening all around us. We tinker with lab brains and the genome. We are now altering the DNA in lab grown brains. Soon we will bend consciousness like a toy. What would you do to his brain if you could?

We want you guys to submit your ideas/stories/and questions pertaining to next week’s topic. You can email us. Or, join our patreon. We want to hear from you. And if you got anything out of today’s episode give us some love, subscribe, and rate us.

Thank you so much everyone for listening. We love you. See you next week on Dating Hypothesis!!!

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